What’s Wrong With Gay Marriage? (A Civil Rights Issue)

I believe that Gay/Lesbian people should be allowed to do whatever it is they want to. What they do behind closed doors is their business (because you have to remember that is those who are opposed that aren't quoting the Bible, they are saying how "disgusting" it is for two people of the same sex to lay down with each other.)

Based solely on the need to dig our country out of this Economic debacle, Gay marriage would totally be a stepping stone to do so. For example, because Vermont legalized Gay marriage and it is estimated that this will increase the state revenue by approximately 30mil over 3 years and create roughly 700 jobs. If you ask me, that is faaaaar better than any stimulus package Congress has passed thus far. I do believe it is a Civil Rights violation not allowing Gays to marry. Though I don't think Gay is the new Black, I understand the correlation. Clearly this isn't an issue in which the government is interested in separating Church and State. Will it ever happen? I don't know, but I am on the edge of my seat waiting anxiously. Imagine what this country would look like if Marijuana and Gay marriage were legal (well the decriminalization of Marijuana)!! Just California alone!! They probably have THE MOST Gays than anywhere else!! Ain't that some shit!?!

As far as bi-sexuality, I don't care either. I mean I do think it has become the thing to do because all the "cool kids" are doing it. I mean if that is the case or it is truely something that someone is into, who am I to tell them not to let their freak flag fly? So long as it isn't messing with me, my money or my man, I'm good. Hell you never know, something good could come out of this; like men learning how to go down on a woman properly from a woman (yet another economic advantage!)...though it could open a whole new world of ppl on the DL...which can ruin lives and put ppl on the opposing side of the Gay/Lesbian debate.

Gay is not the new black only in the sense that unless a gay man or woman is dressed in a "stereotypical" manner (and most do not), one cannot immediately discern their sexual orientation. However, someone black cannot disguise their skin color-- at least not without months of insane bleaching treatments (I'm looking at you, Sammy Sosa). However, I do think gays are entitled to wed. Is it a sin? Is it an abomination? Maybe, but I don't harrass others about their abortions (a sin), premarital sex (a sin), or pork and shrimp eating (abominations), so how would allowing gays to marry affect me?. The answer is it wouldn't. What? You say kids would be confused? Trust me when I say kids are nowhere near as naïve (read: stupid) as you would like to believe. Gay marriage is a simple civil rights issue. Gays should be allowed to have a legal union. Civil rights for all, or civil rights for none.

I live in California and was severely disappointed when the increase in black voter turnout (due to Obama) was determined to be a tipping point in overturning gay marriage rights. Dissapointed because we, as a culture, have the lowest marriage rates so what kind of nerve do we have trying to stop other people from getting married.

Now, one thing that has been pointed out, repeatedly, in California, that the demographics show that Gen X and Y, by far, are more socially liberal and once the younger people account for larger percentages of the voting population (and the old fogies die out-- no offense) gay marriage will pass in the state of California.

I believe my personal views on homosexuality and marriage are irrelevant. I would never allow my personal views to infringe upon the ability of adults to live their lives. That's what bothers me about all of this. To repeat a joke "if you don't believe in gay marriage, don't marry a gay person." Why stop other people from getting married?

The reason I don't like it is because it's a very slippery slope. The gay marriage ban (in CA) was really pushed, and funded, by the Mormon church. I don't know how we can be so short sighted to not see how our lifestyles and choices will soon be under attack. We've opened Pandora's box and they WILL soon turn to blacks and start legislating us, the high out of wedlock birth rate, and all the media hype about it, should tell you so.

------Also let me point out--- the vote in California was not a vote for/against gay marriage. Gay marriage had already BEEN approved and the vote was to take away that right. That's why it bothers me so much. It would bother me less, had there just simply been insufficient support for gay marriage. But this was a bunch of people removing rights that had already been granted.

@C'yo. Where did I misquote scripture? I can tell you both book and verse for all the points that I have made. They are in the Bible , I know because I have read it cover to cover over a dozen times over the course of years with my family during family prayer morning and evening. I am not subverting scripture and would never do so, since I am a firm believer in God and his word. My point was that no one keeps God's word yet we level it against gays when it is convenient. America is not a theoracy. We need to do better for all our citizens.

The marriage contract authorized by the state has NOTHING to do with spirituality or God. The state contract, IMO, is a civil right - not a religious one. I could not care less about same sex marriages. I hold them in the same category I hold marriages by Atheists, Agnostics, or anyone else who does not share my faith.

It amazes me when folks use the 'divinity' of the Bible to validate their personal biases. Seems like folks either aren't aware of or conveniently forget that people used the 'HOLY' Bible to validate The Inquisition, Black Slavery in the USA and the Jewish Genocide of WWII. And it doublely confuses me when non-white people use the 'HOLY' Bible to say why we should treat gays, Muslims & any other group we are uncomfortable with like 2nd-class citizens. Not to say that 'white' people are allowed to speak that foolishness but how do you (this is directed to people of color, particularly 'black folks') in good conscious co-sign on ANY law that says another human or group is not allowed to particapate fully in this society? And please, do NOT tell me what GOD said in the Bible. The Bible was written by people, 'divinely' inspired or not. And anything created by humans is flawed. The Consistitution, amazing document that it is, is flawed. The folks who wrote it, slave-holders and all, understood that. Which is why we can update it, i.e. amendments. Man, I wish we could amend the damn Bible. Maybe a lot of the religious B.S. thrown into this conversation could be brought to a minimum! Maybe we could see our common humanity instead of constantly looking for a yet another reason why we can sh*t on each other in good conscious.

Okay i've gotten in arguments with even members of my family over this issue. First, Marriage is NOT a religious institution. Or if you want to get technical, it is a variation of the Pagan ritual of Handfasting, one that originally had no boundaries. Anyone was able to do so. also if marriage is solely religious, why can you get married in the courthouse?
Second: Gay Marriage is a Civil Rights issue. It is similar to the ban on interracial marriage wherein you can't legally be attached to the one you love. And that is wrong.
Third: I have yet to have anyone actually find me a quote or scripture in the Bible that says homosexuality is wrong. A common example is Sodom and Gomorrah. However, recent studies into the Bible show that the sin discussed may not have been homosexuality, but being inhospitable. (Google it).
I say everyone should be able to marry whoever they want to, no matter man woman blue green whatever. 90% of the population should not be able to dictate the rights of 10% of it. It's a damn shame.

cosign @ Cece Nichole!

You did your homework. Also, once you get to the bottom of it, it really IS just veiled discrimination.

I agree wholehartedly with Ans and Elle. I feel that if two people want to commit to eachother by marriage then I say do it! Really who is it hurting?!!!

in the end resistance to gay union is all about FEAR. period. Its fear of their children being "fooled into" being gay. Its fear of a gay person "getting too close" to themselves. Its fear in its most primitive and least grounded in reality and education. Gay isn't contagious.

I may not agree homosexuality is for ME, but it certainly does not allow me to be brazen and think i can push my beliefs to the point that others do not have civil rights.

The church is apart of this discussion because laws that allow gay marriage would *mandate* little old god fearing pastors to tell two hard back men "you may now kiss the groom" or be penalized by hate crime legislation.

The church is also apart of the discussion because try as you might, you cannot separate the idea of the TRUE God from Holiness. People want to zero in on the idea of a loving God who embraces everything and completely forsake the idea of a God who is not cut from our rapidly decaying moral cloth. Sex is by God's design and it is sacred. Just like race is by God's design and it is sacred. You cannot hold the one in that regard and bastardize the other.

The fact is that despite the massive propaganda machine that allows ppl to believe in a "gay gene", guess who doesn't? No not the church either. SCIENCE!!! Science has not found this illusive gay gene despite billion dollar funding and many years of political incentives to do so.

So the fact remains that sexuality, just like any other discernible behavior, may be the culmination of breeding, socialization, hormonal assertions, societal inclinations and myriad other factors which we will probably never understand because the money isn't pumped into understanding it from that perspective but conversely into solidifying it on the public stage.

So subsequently, will Gay Marriage be legalized all over America? Absolutely. Just as Pederasty was all over Greece and the gay bathhouses were all over Rome. I don't have to tell you what became of those civilizations either. That indomitable free will ranks as most popular of God's designs and we will continue to brandish it like a sword against the one who gave it to us. Is there a price to pay for that? There always is. And you'd be a fool to let Tyra Banks convince you otherwise.

I believe gay people should be entitled to the hellish bondage of marriage as heteros. Why should they be treated special?

Marriage is a legal contract not exclusively between a man and a woman. If religious groupss do not want to allow gay marriage within their religion, that is their right. But if the government is going to sanction marriages it cannot fairly deny it to some adults because some other folks are opposed to whom they choose to marry. That was proven by the unconstitutionallity of miscegenation laws. Some of those same biblical excuses were put forth as reason why people of different races should not be allowed to marry. The same way some interpretation of the bible was used to justify African slavery in previous centuries.

It is a civil rights issue as far as I am concerned, although saying Gay is nthe new Black is probably taking it too far. There is no de jure system directed at oppressing Gays and denying them their rights. No straight only fountains or gays have to sit in the back of the bus. There is certainly violence and prejudice against gay people but no moreso than many black people still have to put up with in jobs and housing. Calling Gay the new Black is unnecessarily incendiary IMO.

If most of the gay people are not born gay then there is an epidemic of insanity plaguing the world. It is practically a death sentence in many societies to be gay and so anyone who would exercise that as a lifestyle choice would have to be sick. It is obvious it is how people are born, there is evidence of homosexuality in other species and so reasonable people can agree it is not a choice.

Just because a few outliers may dabble in bi-sexuality is neither here or there. That line of argument has nothing to do with most gay people. There are people who enjoy all types of sexual expression not sanctioned by society. Many of them are hetero too. Does that detract from staright folks?

I wish every child two loving and supportive parents. There sexuality to me is secondary, many of the social problems we contend with can be traced to bad parents or no parents. Most of those I assume were straight folks. Plus gay people are already allowed to parent, adopt children thus we may as well allow them to marry for the best interest of the children.

I think it is amazing how a society which treats marriage with such disdain, (high divorce rates, multiple marriages, quickie marriages and divorce) can alternately decide the institution is too good for a some of its citizens. Really??

I doubt gay people can do any worse with marriage and I believe they should be allowed to experience the same hell as the rest of us.

Homosexuality has been here forever, Its nothing new, I for one dont agree with it, but Im no one to judge anyone who choose to live that lifestyle. It is suppose to be separations of law and religion, but as you stated its everywhere in our government, the ones who choose these laws feel a certain way about homosexuality based on their beliefs or religion. We have been conditioned by our religion to think a certain way. With that being said its hard to separate what you been conditioned to think differently outside the box.

@SassyNoLA

1st I will say Who Dat! LMAO!

2nd The fact that the research is inconclusive does discredit it. But once again it shouldnt matter if people are or arent. But saying somebody is born gay is like saying I was born liking big asses. I learned to like big asses. If I grow up around white people I wouldnt like skinny flat butt chicks. Preferences are learned its not something your born with. If you were raised around people who preformed beastiality you would be attracted to a donkey or something.

@ C Yo
It sounds like you feel that we should allow something just because of fear that the certain powers will attack other lifestyles. Is that correct?

That's not what happened.

Gay marriage was legal.

An initiative was put on the ballot to ban gay marriage.

The rights were granted.

Voters took them back.

My argument is that we shouldn't repeal rights because it opens a door that may continue and affect us.

Let me put it this way: me personally, I would not have voted for gay marriage, I just would not have voted on the issue. But once gay marriage was legal (and it was, in California), I damn sure wasn't going to vote to repeal it.

I also find it interesting how, people here feel the need to publicly state their disdain for or approval of homosexuality and gay marriage, as if it were some badge of tolerance/rebellion. What does it matter? Should we also then, have a position on Heterosexuality? Do gay people walk around passing judgment on so called "traditional" couples?

This country loves separation, subdivision and categorization about as much as a box full of tabbed binder dividers. Frankly, it's exhausting. As soon as America looses the need to quantify its people and existence by race, class and sexual leaning, I think we'll be a far greater more tolerant people.

@ C Yo,

I want to reply again to give more clarity.

The gay marriage ban is a HUGE deal in California. It's still being litigated. During the election, it was tense as there were so many people and groups watching the polls. It was a close call.The results were discussed ad nauseam throughout talk shows, radio, blogs, etc.

When they recorded video footage of voters exiting the polls, and randon "people on the street" interviews of those who voted for the gay marriage ban, the comments were sickening. These were people who felt that their own personal beliefs and feelings should compel them to take away rights from a group of people.

You're damn right we have to be careful of allowing that type of behavior, because once you open the door, there's no stopping it.

I do believe, that as black people, we have to be very careful of who we give power to and who we align with. Because many of those very same people who are vocal and adamant about gay marriage are racists as well. They don't like us either.

@Brandon - I'd be careful talking about tolerance when your entire diatribe was wholly intolerant of those whose convictions differed from your own. Tolerance is a two-way street you know. If you're heralding it, you might want to try demonstrating it as well ;o).

That's the issue with not having clear-cut standards and order though. We are designed to desire both. So even those who attempt to destroy the current state of them do so by espousing a different set, which is self-defeating. You are administering a moral hierarchy while trying to dissemble mine.

I never said those who believe in a creator receive a "get out of jail free" pass, instead I said we are all subject to God's law. Then again I don't say or believe much else that was postulated in your post, but I understand that it was fueled by your dissatisfaction in life and not my sentiments.

In the future, please try to separate the two and not pin me with ideals which were not my own. Please and thank you ).

@Just so

There are plenty of things that are rooted in something else that doesnt harmonize in thoery ,but it always work. Take Christmas it has nothing to do with Jesus but rather a its based on a pagan holiday. Two things thats shouldnt harmonize is now one of the biggest holiday. Sure for the most part marriage has a religious undertone but the union between two(homo and hetero) people pre-date Christianity.

@Da Throne - I respect your analogy but there are some things that are just diametrically opposed. For instance you said earlier that life was "all over the place without reason and unpredictable", but I doubt you would say that to pardon the molester who rapes your son. So if the world suddenly took to granting pedophiles the right to teach kindergarten, those two things wouldn't fit for you. And I would understand why.

As it extends to things that we don't necessarily care about, morality becomes brooding and so we make it an ambiguous cloud that we can shape like play-doh. As it extends to those things which we hold dear, we will find that the convictions of the heart sharpen and become very clear indeed. Respect.

My dear potato, from my understanding civil unions would grant same sex partners the same rights as marriage. So "unequal" is not what I am positing. What I am positing is ironically what you are positing, which is that the rights of one body shouldn't strip another body of their rights. Only you argue in defense of gays, and I the church. Civil Unions seems like the only compromise on this issue but folks don't want those so we'll just continue fighting *Kanye shrug*.

And the constant comparisons to the struggle of blacks in America is sickening. My last name is still a slave masters name. I don't know my original language, customs, traditions ... ad inifinitum. We have been completely deculturalized, denigrated, enslaved and subjected to treatment that defied the human imagination. With the years in the hundreds and the number of victims in the millions. To compare the deculturilization of blacks with a group whose culture is largely becoming the prevailing American culture is not only erroneous, but disgusting in a way that words fail to describe. So please, let's not do that. Much respect sameway.

@ da throne

there is a difference between inconclusive research and invalid research. those two words are very different, so i'm assuming that you understand the definitions of both words and are choosing to ignore them. whatevs.

so to the research about homosexuality exhibited in animals, you posit that the animals CHOSE their attraction?

having a preference for big butts is different than your sexuality. i prefer tall men. but preferring tall men is not my sexuality. sexuality is biological. definitions of beauty/desirability may be culturally influenced, but sexuality IS NOT. your sexuality is not something you choose. preferences may be culturally influenced. there is no way that you don't understand the difference between the two so i'm assuming you're just being facetious or difficult.

@Brandon - My statement about your dissatisfaction with life had nothing to do with your religious beliefs and everything to with your EXPRESSED poor experiences with religious institutions. I find that much like when folks are burned in a bad relationship, when folks leave the church, a deep-seated bitterness forms. That bitterness infects future experiences and by the looks of your diatribe you were crucifying ME for those bad experiences. Suddenly you know who I am and what I think ...

Your insistence that those people you describe are wrong for their convictions or expressions of them is a judgment you know. And being judgmental in that regard makes you no less condescending, arrogant or intolerant then those you claim to have evolved from. If you cannot see that, then your bias is too strong to be reasoned with. And I'd rather wish you a BEAUTIFUL day or week than to waste my time trying .

I was never "burned" by the church. And am certainly not bitter towards religion or the church. What I am bitter toward, are double standards.

It's funny, because you seem to think you have me "figured out" as well, when really, You don't. My experience in the church was actually great, for the most part. As I matured I had a divergence of philosophy, and who knows, I may decide to return.

I'm not judging anyone. My entire last comment was about letting people do what they wih. I DID say Busta Rhymes was wrong for believing the world would end in five years... for ten. And in turn, I will wish you a very nice week. Its just unfortuante that you feel a discussion such as this is a waste of time.

@Just so you know's comment->( My dear Potato, my first statement in this string was in regards to pastors being forced to marry Gay ppl. Would that be the case with civil unions? No it would not. Civil Unions involve the state while marriage (in the legislation currently offered for the Courts consideration) *also* involves the church. So yes, they are different in make and model. And yes, Gay ppl are fighting for the term. I cannot tell you how many of my gay ppl have told me *exactly* that. What the state does, it does but under the umbrella of religious freedom the state should not force the church to do something that is in objection with it’s ideals. If that doesn’t directly affect your life, then I understand why the terminology may seem homogeneous to you. It does affect my life, and so this isn’t merely a game of semantics for me.) Thanks you so much because you answered everything I asked in my first question and you did it so well. I love awesome dialogue!

http://www.the-dropshow.com "Let's Talk About It"

i think the source of the "gayness" is purely irrelevant. Being born with it or learning it shouldn't dictate what level of rights you are entitled to.

@Brandon - I don't believe the discussion is a waste of time at all. I believe that having it festered with pretense and name-calling is though because no matter what side of the debate you're on, it's already ugly enough.

@C'yo - Tonx .

@CB - Amen!!!

Religion/Church is an oxymoronic entity. They preach love and unity and justify division through their verses. And if you oppose it, they amass their ways in the laws of the land and call it morality. Their "god" is all loving and all "forgiving" except if you take "his" name in vain. Their religious texts speak of their people and gives no inkling of validity to the heritage of those not within their borders. The context of their bibles, scripts etc, have been so bastardized, edited, rewritten, translated thrice by authors unknown. Whole chapters have mysteriously appeared and disappeared. Monarchs have "adjusted" their laws and rules of morality as they see fit and their subjects, like third world countries who trade their past, heritage and people for food, have forgotten abandoned their ancestors, liquidated their ties to whence they came and give their offspring blackened markers across their memories.

Though my parents, relatives, friends, exgirlfriends have all preached "the word" whatever the latest version of it is, everyone interprets differently yet says they agree. No matter how much "love is the answer" and never the question...or is it? No matter the justification by whatever the powers that be. People of religious fervor and dogmatic upbringing that cling to it, have been the least loving,accepting and tolerant of those who do not presently fit their ilk.

Time has shown that the eventuallity of peoples who just want the right of every citizen, get them.

If your religion says love, and doesn't allow for the love outside of your beliefs, you're a fucking hypocrite. Say what you really mean, for example, "My god/religion only allows me to love people within my ranks, all else I just tolerate"

Whether you believe in a god or not, even love or the belief in love starts with the individual accepting of it and not the other way around.

All those opposing gay marriages, how dare you think you super cede someone else's happiness because of your personal beliefs? Apparently your god/belief must be a hoax or you're a bad representative of the love that it purports.

@Just So

How can you compare a child molster to gay peoples right to marry under the law? One is a crime(probably the worst) one is a preference completely different.

I think gay/lesbians should be able to have rights like individuals who are married have. Things like insurance, making decisions in the hospital, health coverage, adoption.

Would it make everyone feel better if we just use another word and not call it marriage?

I mean can you imagine being with someone for 20+ plus years and no contact with your family and you go into the hospital and your judgemental or crazy or whatever else family comes in making decisions on your behalf that is ludacris to me honestly.

i always have a problem when the bible is used to justify an argument. especially a book that has been re-written numerous times, and by people whom we don't know their personal biases and true intentions.

for all the scriptures people use to support their ideals - there are others that refute it. like - aren't we ALL God's children? Isn't he an ALMIGHTY God who knows (and loves) everything HE created? Shouldn't we NOT judge, lest we be judged ourselves? (and so on and so forth).

@ mizze smartly points out, most have a clear idea as to who they are and what their views are. no one who grew up believing one thing is all of a sudden going to change their mind.

i personally don't believe being gay is choice. i don't think people would go through the torment. i disagree with @da throne, who compared sexuality to a preference for big booty. if you are black man, born and raised in a white suburb, where black females are rare - your preference for dating white girls who don't have the same features as black girls would increase due to your environment/surroundings. chances are until you are mobile enough - you aren't leaving your immediate vicinity to search for big booty. i can attest to this as both my brothers date nothing but white females. you go with what you know/are familiar with and works for you. You aren't more/less likely to like girls. But the TYPE of girls you like will be affected.

and for all the 'sin' and abomination talk against homosexuals - heterosexuals can do some pretty horrible/evil things to their children. in fact - MOST (not all) child molesters are NOT gay. they may molest little boys, but that is more about access than anyone else (i won't bring up the sad correlation between certain churches and child molestation).

everyone is entitled to their beliefs and opinion. no one is entitled to agree with them. at the end of the day - i won't care if my mother's doctor, children's teacher, husband's best friend, the firefighter/paramedic rushing to save my life is gay or not. nor do i care if they spend the rest of their lives in a civil union with their partners.

a question to those who believe marriage to be a biblical idea: are men and women who marry on beaches, in las vegas chapels, in parks and other places other than a church, or have their ceremonies officiated by someone other than a priest/pastor - considered not real marriages then? i'm not trying to be facetious..truly wondering. because that would null and void many unions would it not?

Finally to answer some of the questions:
-I do agree that it is a civil rights issue.
-I do believe that people dabble in bi-sexuality (see Girls Gone Wild/spring break videos) for stupid reasons (to impress/turn on men)
-I think that there are great and bad parents out there of BOTH orientations. Over 500,000 children in Haiti need parents. would you deny them a life if a gay couple were to adopt one?
-I think children grow up healthy in healthy loving homes. I think children group up unhealthy in unhealthy homes. Heterosexuals dont have the corner market on either.
-Gay is not the new Black. (but see why besides the catch phrasi-ness of it some people use the idea).

@keshia brown

My point which you seem to miss was that sexual perference is a learned behavior not an genetic one. Which means what you are sexually attracted to is affected by your environment more than any instincts your born with.

Gay marriage.. what a topic!!!!

Yes.. gay marriage is a civil rights issue.. But since some would like to throw in biblical reasons as to why gay marriage should be illegal.. think about this.. The bible clearly states, in several books.. (Revelation, John, Matthew, 1&2 Corithians, Romans) that sex before marriage (fornication) is a sin against God... how many can say that they upheld that law.. Slim to none..

People like to quote the bible and use religion when it convienient for them....

ECC 12:14 For God will bring every deed into judgment, including every hidden
thing, whether it is good or evil. It is not our place to judge, only God alone God alone.

"This country loves separation, subdivision and categorization about as much as a box full of tabbed binder dividers. Frankly, it’s exhausting. As soon as America looses the need to quantify its people and existence by race, class and sexual leaning, I think we’ll be a far greater more tolerant people."

This right here is the core of most problems. I say "preach".

PS: I swear I love living in Germany.

I think gays should be allowed to marry because...

It's a legal issue. If you have a religious issue with it, segregate yourselves from those that sponsor it. They deserve the same legal rights as heterosexuals that want to marry. Like property rights, which by the way is the original reason why legal marriage was created.

I don't think anyone chooses to be gay. I think we are exposed to more gay people because they may feel more comfortable coming out the closet. I bet we can point to someone who was ALWAYS with their "friend". Just couldn't put a name on it.

IJS

can't believe anyone suggested that sexuality is learned. smh. what premise are you basing this conclusion on? in some cultures, women masturbate their baby sons in order to calm them down or induce sleep. do we now assume that those women and children are incestuous? no. different cultures have different sexual practices. sexual acts are not always about sexuality. engaging in sex with a man does not make you gay. prison sex is an obvious example of this- it is a physical need that inmates satisfy with whomever's present. being attracted to a man does make you gay. also, how does that explain brothers growing up in the same culture, home environment, school environment, etc. where 1 brother among many is gay? and the fact of the matter is that homosexuality was and is still being treated as a mental disorder in the realm of religious counseling and, formerly, psychiatry. HOWEVER decades of psychiatric research into environmental/social causes of homosexuality consistently failed to show that homosexuality was a preference to be shaped or reversed. but genetic research actually showing correlation between biology and homosexuality is invalid because it's not conclusive? gtfoh! please show me ANY neurological research that IS conclusive. we don't know much about the brain, but what we do know is all invalid because it isn't conclusive? thank gawd the world of research doesn't operate with this weird ass thought process.

@SassyNoLA

You condemn us for saying its a learned bahavior claiming we have no proof when yours stance is more inconclusives then ours.

You cant pound on your chest and say "Im right Im right" with no evidence yourself. Is there a possibilty homosexuality is something in the brain ofcourse. But without conclusives proof Im forced to draw my on conclusion and I believe sexual preferences is something subliminal we learn probably before we even understand sex. Now until I am giving soild proof otherwise or even a legitimate scienetic agruement that makes me change my mind its in opinion just like yours.

Thank you!

yes and my opinion is based on scientific research. my research shows correlation between biology/genetics and homosexuality. there is NO research that shows links between environment and homosexuality. in fact, the research that has been done in that realm for longer periods of time with looser controls and weak ass measures which makes it much easier to validate your thesis STILL doesn't show correlation. so to compare the two bodies of research and say they're both inconclusive is ABSURD and a perversion of research.

also, my point is that inconclusive research is NOT invalid research. you didn't just stay away from findings actually showing a correlation between biology and homosexuality; you actually said that the research was INVALID because it was INCONCLUSIVE. those two words have different definitions and are not interchangeable, ESPECIALLY in research where much research is inconclusive because we don't know everything HENCE ongoing research, but the case is ESPECIALLY true for the behavioral research you would rely on to support your claim of environmental influence.

this isn't about my opinion being better than anyone else's but to equate my opinion based on correlations established by research and yours based on... nothing because the research does not support your position is disingenuous.

*think

This is a tough subject. For me personally. I have some gay friends but I am a christian and it does go against my beliefs. I also believe you don't turn your back on anyone. Jesus brought himself down so he could witness to other ppl. ON the subject matter of gay marriage, again bcz of my beliefs i don't believe in it but I dont' think it's up to me to say. I would say if you are g oing to allow gay marriage then you have to make it wide open and broad. Some may take this as offensive but what if someone wanted to marry an animal, should this be accepted? IF so, then, why not allow anything and anyone get married. Gay is certainly not the new black. We didnt' choose to be black, we just are. I realize some gay ppl have always been gay, so that's where the linking of gay rights and civil rights come in, but its certainly not the new black. If it was up to me, i probably wouldnt' vote. My other concern is i don't want my kids to feel like the second option they have is being gay. It's just me. i read on here that ppl saying being gay is healthy bcz it keeps us open to new things, that makes me wonder what other options are there? I totally disagree.

I embrace same sex marriages and believe gay/lesbian people should be allowed the same rights I'm allowed. Why? Because who am I to tell two people they can't love, support and be with each other for life? What strife is their love going to put on my life? None. It goes against the Constitution to deny them rights based on sexuality the same way it was wrong to deny Black people rights based on them being something they have no effect on. Just because they're different doesn't mean they aren't still humans.

I'm an agnostic Christian (raised Southern Baptist, believe it or not) and the Bible is a guideline for life back then. The relevance of it now is summed up by two things: Love each other. Love God. If someone I love wants to marry their own sex, I'm all for it, out of love for them.

I believe you are born gay. And I think people who "play" bisexual are annoying.

As for gay people raising children, why not? A child born from an alternative lifestyle in my opinion would be the same as any other kid. They make their own choices throughout life so it doesn't matter who they are raised by as long as they are raised right.

There will be a punishment whether u like it or not for all sexual immorality, gay, bi, and whatever else is not a man and woman.
God bless those of u who think people are stuck gay that’s not true. If you believe in Jesus then you realize because He died on the cross any one can be saved and changed by the Holy Spirit. I hope you all will receive the truth!