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Men Lie, Women Lie, But Do They Really Have To?

Illustration: Truth and Lie

Adapted from “You Don’t Have To Lie to Kick It,” by Zach Davis

I initially decided to write this after I had heard some troubling headlines in the news. One of my favorite football players was murdered, and another man had boiling water poured on his genitals. Both were done by women they were dealing with and not being straight up.

Could either situation have been avoided or was a crime of passion the sole reason for both?

In my opinion, telling these women the truth could have possibly saved a family and a man's balls a lot of pain. There are mentally unstable people out there and you never know what a motherfucker is capable of in the heat of the moment. Yeah, men play big and bad, but I believe both the above occurrences happened while the brothers were asleep.

You can't stay awake forever, can you?

Being up front and honest from the get-go gives a woman a chance to choose if this is something she wants. I don't care what it is; tell her. That way you can always say, "We talked about this." If you don't want anything serious, tell her and see what she does. Nine times out of 10 she’ll still fuck with you.

In her mind she may think she can change that, but at least it’s out in the open. To be sure she doesn’t confuse your relationship; do not be afraid to remind her about this conversation once a month and reiterate that “this is what it is.”

Nothing more.

Nothing less.

Playing games with women and their feelings is where many men underestimate the fairer species. When a man’s jerked around, all we can usually come up with is kicking someone’s ass. A woman’s revenge, however, is more devious and plotting.

They’ll mess up your car, your house, your marriage, your career, your friendships, and your whole world. All because you kept pillow-talking about how you two are going to be this and do that. There’s even a show on one of the cable channels (I can’t recall which one at the moment) where it’s all about women that reach their breaking point. Turn it on, fellas, and listen to the stories of what can happen to your ass for “playing with this young girl’s heart,” as the fallen King of Pop would say. Life isn’t a game and shouldn’t be played as such; there isn’t a reset button on this shit.

Fellas, from the gate let a woman know what’s what. If she doesn’t like it, the next one will. There are plenty of fish in the sea. Go catch you a new one. Lying just leads to more lying and sooner or later the gig is up. How many people do you know that can get away with it for any decent amount of time?

If a United States President couldn’t keep his shit under wraps, how the hell are you? You’re the same dude that can’t remember to put the toilet seat down, but now you’re trying to live a double life? Wake up, before you don’t. Some women feel if they can’t have you then no one will. Either that, or you need to pay for the games you play.

One way or another.

Have you ever been lied to by someone you were dating? How did you find out? Did they give you a valid reason for their deception or was it a big load of crap? How long did you stay with them afterwards? Would you have more respect for a partner that was straight up with you? Or do you believe that ignorance is bliss? Do you feel that one sex is more likely to lie than the other or is that based more on the individual’s character? Does your mate have the right to destroy your property or physically harm you if they catch you in a devastating lie? Have you ever lied to someone you were dating? Why? Did you ever get caught in the lie? Why do you think so many people lie instead of telling the truth?

Speak your piece…

Today’s post came courtesy of Zach Davis, co-author of Roses and Brass Knuckles: A Man’s Pocket Guide to Winning the Dating and Marriage Game, which is an honest, insightful book presenting 15 basic principles to help men succeed in dating and marriage. For more information or to order your own copy visit, www.rosesnbrassknuckles.com.

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  • mizze

    "If you don’t want anything serious, tell her and see what she does. Nine times out of 10 she’ll still fuck with you." -- and this about sums it up! I know SOOO many females who have messed with dudes after him saying that he doesnt want to be in a relationship and it is because they want to be THAT chick who changes his mind.. that seldom happens though..

    I feel that if a man tells you all he wants is sex- im sorry but that is all I sum up "casual dating" with no commitment and no intent to have one as- then dont be mad if thats all he wants you for. The only thing that men dont quite get is that you cant be telling a female you dont want a relationship but be doing boyfriend/girlfriend things.. i.e- going to the movies, calling and texting throughout the day, meeting his friends, going on trips, shopping together, bull like that basically.. I wholly believe that if a man say he dont wanna be in a relationship and you decide to mess with him anyways- thats on you. But I dont like it when dudes send mixed signals either. Dont be havin the chick cook yo meals and wash yo clothes- doing girlfriend type shit- then turn around and say that "this is all it can be".. thats where some chicks go off. However, I dont think ANY thing a man does to a female gives her the right to kill him or damage his property..

    But thats just me- men will learn one day that not all women think like this...I also know that women can get so mad that they act out of complete insanity

    Oh, I have lied plenty of times.. YOu tell some men "this p%*$y is his" and you got your tuition paid- and trust cause I have had that done for me.. NOT saying that was the only reason I was messing with him.. I just feel everybody lies to someone they dont care deeply enough about be it men or women..

  • Andrialynn

    Honesty is the best policy for me.

  • Jessica J

    Ah, what a day it will be when people actually feel what you mean, and not see it. I think the eyes makes us dumber. I totally get what you mean NWSO. Why does the skin matter? BTW, I love all of your pictures. I'm suprised you find so many that say exactly what you talking about.

  • MsHollywood

    lmfao@ the same man who can't remember to put the toilet seat down is leading a double life??? OMG I couldn't have said it better myself :)

    I AGREE WITH ALL WRITTEN ABOVE!

    This reminds me my feelings and opinion about Eldrick "Tiger" Woods on my Facebook/Twitter:

    "I don't get it... If you're not ready to be MONOGAMOUS WHY BE WITH ONE PERSON... That's the whole definition of the word ... and an expectation in a marriage/relationship!!! Save yourself the headache of having to lie and get caught and sow your wild oats.... This is basic 1+1 arithmetic ppl!!!
    I'm just saying... Eldrick woods f****D up !!! He said so himself " I felt like money and fame entitled me to certain things" uhhhhhhh yesssssssssssss!!!!!! Duh!
    LIVE IT UP OR GIVE IT UP!!"

    First of all, who says you have to get married/have a relationship? Why would we do that if we aren't married?
    It's like sending yourself to prison on lockdown for a crime you didn't do!
    If you didn't do the crime don't pay the time!
    If you paid your dues and you're past due well that's a different story!!!

    And yes, some women stick around even after the truth but at that point if the woman is not "getting it" then the guys have to step away!

    Have you ever been lied to by someone you were dating? ABSOLUTELY! WHO HASN'T!

    How did you find out?
    I caught them.

    Did they give you a valid reason for their deception or was it a big load of crap? If they went to the extremes of having to lie that badly they usually hit you with the big load.

    How long did you stay with them afterwards?
    Very, very little time... as soon as the dust settled I realized it was a wrap!
    Would you have more respect for a partner that was straight up with you? Or do you believe that ignorance is bliss?
    TELL ME THE TRUTH!
    Do you feel that one sex is more likely to lie than the other or is that based more on the individual’s character?
    No, I think we are all prone to lie but women voice their pain so much more than men so it seems as if the ladies are hurt more often.

    Does your mate have the right to destroy your property or physically harm you if they catch you in a devastating lie?
    What is the measuring stick for a devastating lie?That can differ from person to person... but if it's bad enough I say they do have the right.
    Have you ever lied to someone you were dating?
    I lied once.... but I didn't cheat. My ex found out I slept with someone else while BROKEN UP and after he cheated on me but I had to lie because he was a PSYCHO. After that, I'm with Andrialynn...HONESTY IS THE BEST POLICY FOR ME.
    Why do you think so many people lie instead of telling the truth?
    Many reasons... fear of the outcome/drama, greediness, low self esteem, guilt...

  • MsHollywood

    :)

  • Avah Royal

    I respect real. Point blank.

    Anything else suffers consequences. I can't say that I'll be killing a dude in his sleep, but I really don't know since I've never been put in any situation even remotely similar.

    I also feel that you get what you give. In SOME men's defense I must say that there are some women who make it difficult to lay the real on the line...this does not justify lying, but there are some jack a**es that mind fu*ked themselves into thinking lying is for HER benfefit. WTF is that!?

  • Elle

    Have you ever been lied to by someone you were dating?
    - Of course. I think everyone has.

    How did you find out?
    - Don't quite remember. Usually it is either one of two things: the lie is sooo out of this world that it is obvious. Or I can simply hear it in the person's voice that they are lying. It's a werid gut feeling/ intuition thing. A tiny voice in my mind tells me "he's lying". And that voice has never failed me.

    Did they give you a valid reason for their deception or was it a big load of crap?
    - Um no valid reason. Is there ever a valid reason to lie to somebody? I don't think so. Everyone who knows me personally knows that I am a very understanding and forgiving person. There is no need to lie to me because you can trust me to empathize and see things from your perspective. If a person still decides to lie to me it is either about a really important issue and something I wouldn't forgive OR that person obviously doesn't really know me to know better.
    What I love is when especially men try that old jedi mind trick of turning their BS slip up around on me. Love it!

    How long did you stay with them afterwards?
    - Much too long as far as my drug dealer ex is concerned. In an other instance lies were told before a relationship was even formed. So there was no real harm done.

    Would you have more respect for a partner that was straight up with you? Or do you believe that ignorance is bliss?
    - Most definitely! I can respect a person who admits to his/her failures and shortcomings. I want to know exactly who and what I am dealing with. That way I can make an educated decision.

    Do you feel that one sex is more likely to lie than the other or is that based more on the individual’s character?
    - My guess is that it has more to do with a person's character. Folks lie due to a lack of self esteem, lack of integrity, in order to manipulate others and get their way. And those traits are not linked to gender. Do I want to associate with people like that - male or female? No, definitely not.

    Does your mate have the right to destroy your property or physically harm you if they catch you in a devastating lie?
    - Does he have THE RIGHT to? Nope. Legally speaking. But I understand how people need revenge to restore the balance in the universe. I've had strong feelings of wanting revenge before but never acted on them. But I cannot guarantee that the right (or should I say wrong) combination of variables in a scenario won't push me over the edge.

    Have you ever lied to someone you were dating? Why? Did you ever get caught in the lie?
    - I am sure I have - usually to spare the person's feelings (for example criticizing their performance in the bedroom). Did I get caught? Hmm, nope. Not that I can remember. I was never confronted about having told a lie. That either means I do not lie a lot or I am plain good at it. Who knows.

    Why do you think so many people lie instead of telling the truth?
    - Fear of confrontation and conflict. They are too weak to deal with the potential consqeuences of telling the truth.

  • http://www.dashofreality.wordpress.com Dash

    I believe the show is called "Snapped" (the show is crazy and addicting) or is there another one where the women lose their marbles and go bat? But it just goes to show the lengths of the human psyche and capability. Women (and men) are not toys. Barrington Levy said it best:
    I'm too experienced to be taken for a
    stroll...too experienced for someone to rock and roll, I'm too experienced to be taken for a ride, and I know it's not my foolish pride
    ...I think she wants a clown, someone to take
    for a ride, this is what I sing...
    'Tis the truth

  • BangShang

    I think men/women want the truth but in reality people cant handle the truth. Keeping it 100.

  • bklyngrrl

    Ugh!

    I am very honest when it comes to my relationships. I am not especially attached to customary standards of monogamy and have been in honestly open situations.

    As Elle said most dudes lie so early on (or so habitually) that it is easy to weed them out before they can really do any damage. Others get sloppy or tired and stuff slips out. Still my last two relationships ended not because of other women, but because of lies about other woman.

    Brother #1 sent me a link to the wrong online photo album-- instead of his mom's new home I saw him hugged up with his out of town ex in photos date stamped to the weekend he picked a particularly ugly, mean fight with me even though it was the one weekend I was off of work during a particularly rough patch at work. I keep a journal. He had been especially solicitous in making up to me after the weekend but it was 6 months or so before I understood what had set him off- he needed an excuse to spend the only free weekend I had that winter with someone else. We didn't break up immediately but that was the beginning of the end.

    Brother #2 was Mr. Mixed Signals. We started out with the following understanding, he was wary of a full on relationship and I was not gonna pretend not to have feelings, we would both be honest and it seemed we were in our regular and cards on the table conversations. At some point I decided I was too attached and we stopped seeing each other for about six months (what is is about six months???) when he reappeared in hot pursuit. We reconnect and following his lead, enter into a truly dreamy, ostensibly monogamous (he is obsessed with maintaining absolute fidelity, in retrospect a red flag...) relationship which I thought still featured full, free communication until he shows up at my job to tearfully confess out of the freaking blue that his "other woman," found out about me. He is afraid she might try to confront me and begs me to lie. I refuse because I value my integrity. She never shows up and we have been separated for a year now. He is allegedly single and sniffing around again... He is scarily still attractive to me even after all of the drama. I am hoping I can maintain a connection to reason because I am clear he is a serial cheater.

  • DC Man With a Plan

    Whateva. IF you're a grown azz woman, doin dudes laundry and "actin" like a wife, but he doesn't treat you like a wife, though he may tell you shyt that YOU think a wife would hear, YO azz needs to check yourself. Actions, not words are the key to solid relationships. You do laundry and cook; what does he do for YOU that's like a husband or boyfriend? Men shouldn't lie and neither should women. But shyt happens, so be grown about getting duped; learn from it and move the f@ck on. Why catch a case that can follow you for LIFE (and f@ck up your next back ground check for that GREAT position) just bcuz you got suckered into closing your eyes to the REAL shyt that was happening around you, OR bcuz you got caught up in a dating game for which you were naive and unprepared? How do you get dating experience? By reading books or by doing the damn thing? Well, some of the most memorable lessons are learned the hard way. If a woman EVA, EVA burns or breaks ANY of my shyt, I will return the favor. Two can play that game! Fortunately, I have NOT been one to treat women as toys or fools....But still, I don't play that shyt all the same! So if you’re a woman who thinks you can smash my windows, or cut my tires, but your car is immune……..Think again, bcuz I'm not gonna be the only one calling Geico!

  • Shannon

    That is the central issue for me. Men say one thing and do another and I'm just supposed to suck it up and get over it. Sometimes, what I think men don't get is that it's not as simple as that. I'm well aware that men are really not okay with my expectations and more likely than not will reject it in favor of a woman who will meet their terms and conditions--we all have them regarding relationships, what we will and won't accept--and if men were upfront and honest about what they wanted, that would be the end of it for me.

    The problem is, men aren't. This isn't to say women are always honest and are the victims here, but the thing is men want to have their cake and eat it too. I know everyone says all is fair in love and war, but is it fair for someone to play with your heart and mess with your feelings? And is it fair when the scorned party--remember, hell hath no fury like a woman scorned--decides to even the score?

    I've been lied to a lot, no more than most, but I've always been upfront with men and very clear about what was important to me. I know most men won't give any woman they can't sex the time of day in a clock shop, but what is so wrong with being honest? Isn't honesty supposed to be the best policy?

    I never stayed around long after finding out someone lied to me. I have this whole no-nonsense attitude and lying is just one of my pet peeves. Most times, lies just have a way of making themselves known; they seem to find a way.

    IMO, there is NEVER a legitimate reason for lying. People are hurt more by lies and misunderstandings than anything else. People lie for one purpose--their own self-interest. People will lie if it gets them what they want and if it worked in the past, they will keep doing it until it no longer works and they simply move on to a new strategy.

    I would have a lot more respect for men if they were straight-up with me. It would save us a lot of frustration and heartache later on. If men were more honest in relationships and about what they want instead of making it some huge secret, things would go a lot better because I would then be able to make an informed decision. I tell men all the time, "Just be honest and upfront about what you want," and they tell me, "Well, if I told you all I wanted was to hit it and quit, no woman would ever give it up." I told him, "Maybe not, but you should at least respect her enough to let her make that decision for herself instead of deciding what role she plays in your life. How do you know she wants to be just your bed buddy?" How can two people ever be on the same page if one is being deceptive?

    Women and men lie in relationships, but for the most part, women lie to spare men's feelings, especially when it comes to bedroom performance. I have heard so many women talk about how they faked an orgasm so the man's feelings and ego wouldn't be hurt or told him they liked something he bought for them. I can't be that kind of deceptive myself; I'm too blunt for that.

    As far as physical harm or destruction of property if your partner lied to you--well, that's relative. Men can never outdo a woman when it comes to love and revenge, but it really depends on the situation. In most cases, men who lie usually don't learn any lesson other than lying works, keep doing it. But when a woman snaps, like one of my male friends told me his girl did when she caught him with another woman in their bed, it taught him the hard way never to mess with a woman's feelings. I mean, I've never done it myself, but there are a few men that made me want to do it.

  • Sherell

    NWSO yo are so on with this one!
    I had a guy lie to me and say I was the one. Wanted to marry me and all that BS. We had only been seeing each other for a short while and he wanted to get intimate.

    Said he was divorced but I never went over his house, he always had an excuse:renovation...etc Finally I did a little checking (got the address and home number) and lo and behold the wife was still at home.

    Funny though, he was the rebound guy and if he had just been honest he may have gotten the goodies, but the blatant lying made me kick him to the curb!

    I definitely would have more respect for a person when they are being honest.

    Both sexes lie, but I think guys take it a bit further. Women may lie about having another guy , men will lie and say you are the one, they want to get married and have children, when in fact they just want to f--k!

    No one has the right to destroy property or physically harm anyone but some peoples lies are emotionally damaging and they string someone along and I understand why folks get upset.

    I have told small lies like being busy when I was not, but I have never lied about how I feel, my mistake was one of omission.

  • N2Deep

    I second Elle's motions.

    I believe almost everyone has had to lie before even if it was to spare a feeling or two. It's sad that sometimes the truth can do more to damage a relationship than a lie especially when its dealing with perception.

    I rather tell the truth but even then it might hurt and cause a strain on the relationship so its damned if you do or damned if you don't.

    The main time I believe you should always tell the truth is when it comes to telling someone that you love or are in love with them. Thats where shit gets crazy and people get hurt a lot deeper.

  • DC Man With a Plan

    lmao..first off, todays writer is a GUEST Sockhead by the name of Zach, which you can also discern by the tone and words dude used, so stop attributing to NWSO comments intended for Zach.
    (climbing out on a limb)......This we ALL know: Women think differently about relationships, BUT.....since women are and want to be in relationships with men, y'all gonna have to understand dating life from a man's perspective. WOMEN like the tradition of men asking for the digits, paying for the dates, yada-yada. Y'all want it to be different, do the damn thing differently. YOU be the one paying for everything and getting serviced and expected to buy flowers, wash the car, cut the grass and SEE if your attitude about being "privileged" doesn't change about lying and ALL that can possibly go with initating a relationship. I didn't say it was right--I just said IF y'all did the shyt WE are expected to do, you'd SEE it differently and be singing a different song. BUT bcuz we have fairly strict gender roles, all MOST women can do is "think" like a woman, tryin to think as a man. That ain't gettin it. I can bet you this: Most men could get the woman's role and NOT make the silly azz mistakes y'all make in matters of love and what looks like love, but most women CAN'T get being a man, hence the reason some of y'all get F@cked ova so much. It's still on you though, Boo.....

  • Sherell

    Woman and men want different things in a relationship that ie why so many women get caugh up. Also, it takes longer for a guy to fall in love.
    Not all woman expect a guy to but them things, especially those that generally make more than a guy.

    And yes I have lied about a man's performance in bed. Probably most women have!

  • Rastaman

    There is no doubt in my mind that I have been lied to by someone I have been dating. No specific situation stands out but I beleive lying is part of humans' natural state. I can't say I am someone who is automatically put off by lying, I think that is too "babe in the woods". I am more concerned about motive.

    I understood very early in life that people lie out of fear: Fear of harm; Fear of conflict; Fear of punishment; Fear of rejection; Fear of loss and Altruistic Reasons.

    The last one is kind of funny because, nearly everyone does it and if you don't you are considered rude and unpleasant. Telling someone they look good when they in fact look like hell. But I am certain most people don't consider that lying.

    I am more offended by minor lies people seem to tell. Their age, their name or even what they do for living. The sort of things that are easily verifiable because I consider that an insult to my intelligence. That to me speaks to a lack of respect. I makes me very doubtful about them that they need to lie about really minor concerns.

    I think in our society not lying is really hard because it is so often rewarded and promoted. we encourage each other to lie to others all the time as if its harmless fun. the military policy of "Don't ask, Don't Tell" is officially sanctioned lying.

    How many people would feel secure in a relationship where "Don't ask, Don't Tell" was the rule?

    Lying is universal, how many of us would condem a woman who lied for "fear of harm" from her volatile man?

    Even in the Ten Commandments, the only reference to lying is lying on someone (bearing false witness against...).

    When people we trust lie it invariably erodes our trust in them and makes us uncertain. Being unsure and untrusting is not a state most of us find comforting. So its not unreasonable that making someone uncomfortable and uncertain would cause them to lash out violently or seek revenge. Afterall part of trusting is being vulnerable, violating that can be perceived by some as an attack on their person. Not legally but I can understand.

    I am sure I have lied to someone I am dating, no one has ever confronted me about it but I am gonna assume it probably was not worth a confrontation. Primarily because I try not to lie too often, it really takes too much effort to maintain a lie and then you have to lie to cover the original lies. Next thing you know you Tiger Woods.

    So yeah, I am not morally opposed to lying just the work it takes to maintain.

    But I have also not been as succesful with the ladies as some of my peers. One of the things I have learned is that when most women say they want a man that is honest with them, they really mean, I want a man who will tell me what I want to hear. that "altruistic" lying again.

    The fundamental reason people lie is because it works and even when found out the lying is either overlooked or forgiven.

    "And after all, what is a lie? Tis but The truth in masquerade." Lord Byron

  • Anonymous

    Men are men..women are women- lets stop trying to act like one is better or worse off than the other.. Men cannot and will not ever be able to hold themselves and live up to the standards that society places on women= the career woman, the mother, the wife... point blank.. So people need to stop trying to compare roles and what one sex does over the other.. ITs about LIES men tell, not if a woman FEEL she can be a better man than a man, or if a man feel he can be a better woman than women today.. PLEASE. Thats delusional.

    What you do is what you do- I cant stand when people try to justify lying!!! I dont care if women made you walk to hell and back, what the hell does that have to do with lying? ANd if you wanna play with the big leagues and get the balls to lie and justify it- have the balls to reap the repercussions of it..

  • QuoteMan

    "What a pity that youth must be wasted on the young". .....knew the good, the bad & the consequences but sometimes as a youth perversity can get the best of you.

    Curse that dreadful day a brother had to run out through the fire escape of an Ex's house in my boxers, being chased with hmm(fill in the blank).... What a lie can do.

    Hey, you living you learn. Why do folks lie?, one may ask, the thrills of chauvinism, the bliss of ignorance, lack of courage, insecurities, some might say, but I believe that's a nagging question that remains. Bill Clinton once blatantly said just because I can.

    Every dog has its day, can't lie forever. Word to the wise is enough, one!

  • Lonias

    Have you ever been lied to by someone you were dating? YES

    How did you find out?
    A MUTUAL FRIEND...AND I DIDN'T BELIEVE HER BECAUSE I DIDN'T WANT TO...

    Did they give you a valid reason for their deception or was it a big load of crap?
    IT'S ALWAYS A LOAD OF CRAP

    How long did you stay with them afterwards?
    YEARS

    Would you have more respect for a partner that was straight up with you?
    YES

    Or do you believe that ignorance is bliss?
    EVEN IF IT IS, IT WON'T BE FOREVER...

    Do you feel that one sex is more likely to lie than the other or is that based more on the individual’s character? INTEGRITY IS A HEART ISSUE. AN INDIVIDUAL'S CHARACTER DETERMINES THEIR COMMITTMENT TO THE TRUTH.

    Does your mate have the right to destroy your property or physically harm you if they catch you in a devastating lie? NO

    Have you ever lied to someone you were dating? Why? YES.
    ANYTIME I'VE EVER LIED, IT WAS TO PROTECT MYSELF FROM CONSEQUENCES...ISN'T THAT THE MOST COMMON REASON?

    Did you ever get caught in the lie?
    YES

    Why do you think so many people lie instead of telling the truth?
    AS I MENTIONED ABOVE, IT'S USUALLY TO ESCAPE EXPECTED CONSEQUENCES. WHAT WE OFTEN DON'T REALIZE WHEN WE TELL A LIE IS THAT THE CONSEQUENCES MAY NOT BE WHAT WE IMAGINE AT ALL. THE PERSON(S) WE'RE LYING TO MAY BE MORE MERCIFUL/UNDESTANDING THAN WE THINK. THAT'S WHY HONESTY IS THE BEST POLICY. IT MAKES THE PLAYING FIELD LEVEL FOR ALL PLAYERS AFFECTED BY THE END RESULT.

  • Shequita

    I was like who has the potty mouth today lol......anywho the shoe is called "snapped"

    vERY GOOD POST.

    Lying is bad but it happens. Been guilty of this. In the end, your gonna be the one thats hurt the most. Telling the truth can help anyone in any kind of relationship avoid alot of heartache. "I lied to you because I love you" Im sure we've heard some derivative of that, or "I lied because I didnt want to hurt you"....honesty is truly the best policy. If your lying to keep someone there, thats not real love thats superficial and its selfish (lesson recently learned). Be true to you!

  • Shequita

    Rastaman "I understood very early in life that people lie out of fear: Fear of harm; Fear of conflict; Fear of punishment; Fear of rejection; Fear of loss and Altruistic Reasons"

    Good point!

  • artsyheartsy

    Rastaman,

    I don't think that women who ask for the truth want to hear anything but the truth. I think that men who use this rationale to justify lying are afraid that women who are armed with the truth might either opt out or (and I think this is actually harder for most men) opt in if they can have equal terms.

    We live in a society that encourages men to be charmers of dubious integrity and expects women to treat any non-exclusive relationship as an insult setting up the ridiculously cliched situations we are all too familiar with. Tell the truth and choose to relate polyamorously!

  • pintsize1

    Have you ever been lied to by someone you were dating?

    NOT THAT I KNOW OF, SO I'LL KEEP IT THAT WAY

    Would you have more respect for a partner that was straight up with you?

    OFCOURSE YOU WOULD HAVE MORE RESPECT FPR THE PARTNER, BUT, THERES ALWAYS A BUT, MOST PEOPLE REALLY CANT STOMACH THE TRUTH.

    Or do you believe that ignorance is bliss?

    TO A CERTAIN DEGREE, HONESTLY IS GREAT THING, EVERYONE LIES THOUGH, CERTAIN THINGS WE DO SHOULD BE KEPT WHERE THERE AT, IN THE DARK, DRAMA COMES AFTER YOU REVEAL THEM...IM TALKING ABOUT LITTLE LIES, NOTHING BIG, EITHER WAY THEY WILL COME OUT AND BITE YOU IN THE ASS.

    Do you feel that one sex is more likely to lie than the other or is that based more on the individual’s character?

    BOTH SEXES LIE, WOMAN ARE MORE SNEAKY ABOUT THEIRS, MEN, NOT SO MUCH, SEEMS LIKE THEY WANT TO GET CAUGHT WITH CERTAIN ACTIONS THEY DO.

    Does your mate have the right to destroy your property or physically harm you if they catch you in a devastating lie?

    DESTROYING PROPERTY AND OTHER THINGS ARE CHILDISH TO ME, YES TO SOME ITS A FORM OFF RELIEVING FUSTRATION, BUT THERES ALWAYS OTHER WAYS TO RELEASE ANGER.

    Have you ever lied to someone you were dating? Why?

    YES I HAVE, I TRY MY BEST TO BE HONEST, AND SOMETIMES BEING HONEST BACKFIRES BECAUSE AS I STATED SOME PEOPLE CANT HANDLE THE TRUTH, SOME THINGS SHOULD STAY PRIVATE, FOR THE SAKE OF THE RELATIONSHIP.

    Did you ever get caught in the lie?

    NO, I TOLD THE TRUTH, I WOULDNT GET CAUGHT UP IN A LIE LOL.

    Why do you think so many people lie instead of telling the truth?

    AS STATED WE CANT HANDLE THE TRUTH, WE DONT KNOW HOW TO DEAL WITH IT.

  • The Duchess

    NWSO, you are SOOOOOOO ON POINT!!!

  • Rastaman

    @artsyheartsy

    A primary reason con artist are so succesful swindling people is because so few report it out of a fear of the embarassment. So along that same line of thinking I doubt many woman who claim they required honesty but accepted being "charmed" would willingly admit they accepted the lie because it felt better.

    The only thing worst than being made a fool of is having others know you have been made a fool of...

    People are not that complicated as they pretend to be....my aim is to not excuse bad male behavior but to illusrtrate that lying in relationships are often succesful because it benefits the listeners to believe.

  • Gemini

    @ DC Man. You went out on a limb and I hope it BREAKS! Reading your comment says to me that loving and caring for a man is a silly azz mistake.

    Well I'm happy to hear one of you finally admit it.

    If a women did all the things you mentioned for a man (and alot of us have) then that same simple minded man would label the woman a TRICK! and continue to take advantage, so makes the female time bomb. Some men really don't get it.

  • artsyheartsy

    Rastaman,
    I think we are largely in agreement. Everyone has skin in this con game. If folks were to accept radical honesty they would have to release tired notions of shame and propriety. We might ideally replace them with respect and honesty.

    In a full disclosure world men wouldn't "have to" lie and women wouldn't "have to" pretend to believe them. On a deeper level this would open up some more honest discussions about sexuality and relationships that would upset a whole lot of apple carts. Imagine folks being openly non-monogamous, or gay or bi or celibate or whatever worked for them and their fully informed partner(s)? Maury would go off the air and we might finally get marriage equality...

  • DC Man With a Plan

    Sounds like "Anonymous" has some pent up anger issues.....smdh. This is an exercise in the HYPOTHETICAL. You're putting wayyy too much thought and your personal B/S into this subject. Lying happens--read Rasta man's commentary; from taxes to why you didn't go to work, to why you missed an appointment to how that dress looks on your girlfriend, YOU have told some lies and felt NOTHING about it. U feel entitled to burn some dudes shyt do it, but don't expect ME to hold him back if he doesn't wanna play by the rule that says men don't hit women. As you said, YOU wanna run with the big dogs......
    As far as every woman having domestic skills, mommy skills, etc,. Bullshyt. Some of y'all can't boil a 10 minute egg without it running out of water; others can't dust a glass table, so naw, women don't get a generic pass for having to "do it all." Some do it all, some can't do shyt! 26 letters in the alphabet and You're anonymous; you can't even come up with a screen name you're so indecisive......sm-mfh.......

  • mizze

    @ Gemini- CO-SIGN!! Im pretty sure when people use the examples that I, MYSELF, state as a way to turn it around and say something contrary to what I stated, they are basically talking to me, but i learned that "Wise men never argue with fools, because people from a distance can't tell who is who".. Its pointless..

    One of my favorite quotes is "There is no such thing as conversation. It is an illusion. There are intersecting monologues, that is all" by Rebecca West. This sums up some of the posts that are on here. To be a blog on OPINIONS, most dont want to hear anyone elses. Most dont come on here to get their mind changed or even open up to the idea to see where other people are coming from. Some are on here solely to state their opinion and disagree with anyone else who does not conform to theirs. THey dont want a conversation-even when they reply to someone. Its just their opinion, stated again, in a different way

    @Rastaman- I agree with you, especially “I understood very early in life that people lie out of fear: Fear of harm; Fear of conflict; Fear of punishment; Fear of rejection; Fear of loss and Altruistic Reasons” to a certain extent. However, as ArtsyHeartsy pointed out, I do believe that sometimes men do use lies as a way to try and justify the lying. As do women. I am a strong believer of not asking a question you arent prepared to hear the answer. If I, personally, ask for the truth I WANT IT. No matter how bad it hurts, or how shocking it is to believe, I want to know because that leads to my next decision of whether to stay or not. AND THERE, is where I think you left out that people lie out of selfishness. I believe that if these men told women the truth, they KNOW that most women (and there is a difference between a woman and a female) wont put up with the bull. They dont wanna risk losing a perfect "non-relationship"- sex and companionship at their leisure with no commitment- no arguing, talking about feelings, bills, no children, can still mess with other people on the side. ITS GREAT. Why risk giving a woman the heads up and lose all this?? THAT is why people lie. (well, part of it among many other things you pointed out very well) I do think that some men can tell certain women the dirt-dog truth and these women STILL wanna mess with them. But if someone is the type of man that WANTS this type of woman- HUMMMMMMM.. says a lot about HIM as well as her.

  • DC Man With a Plan

    @ Gemini.....Expressing a common mis-conception for the sake of conversation, or playing the devil's advocate is something I have no problem doing, but don't get it twisted, I ALSO said it doesn't apply to me, which you and anonymous conveniently over-looked, becuz I've NEVER had a woman feel the need to go postal about how I represent myself. I do not know what dude U f@cking with that needs YOU to cook, clean and do his laundry, but that's a sorry azz mo-fo and you need to know that sooner than later. At the same time, I'm sure whateva he did that you didn't mention was a benefit to you. Women can easily forget how difficult it is to take groceries up 3 flights of stairs bucz their "man" handled that, or forget that yeah, you did the cooking, but when you were at the grocery store--he pulled out the cash at the register. hmmm. Nothing is EVER one sided. Women always act like they give and get nothing in return. But IF you do give and get nothing in return, WTF is wrong with you? There are tons of men that have been dogged; bought cars, furniture, TV, cell phone plans; paid electric bills, gassed up cars--that belonged to their boo...only to get dismissed once the cash ran dry. Stop playing like y'all victims. YOou SPECIFICALLY might be a victim, but it's not a universal woman suffrage kinda thing. If you Gemini run into liars and cheats, trust that's your experience. Grown azz men know what they want and are true to what they have.

  • DC Man With a Plan

    @ Mizze...how about if YOU Stop having non-relationship sex? When did that become what proper women do? THAT's a "truth" most women today don't want to hear. And a big part of what Rasta ALSO said is that the people being lied to--often have an investment in accepting and believing the lie bcuz it's easier than the truth. Maybe YOU'RE the one slutty lady everbody wants to bang, but nobody wants to claim as their woman or wife. How's that for "truth?" Did that fit you well?

  • sugar

    I believe that men and woman have both been played equally. Men have a role to play and were sorta raised to stay strong and move on quicker to the next one. Men have feelings, but their reactions are totally different from women. As a woman myself I can see how I was raised to be emotional, caring, and a backbone in a family. So whenever I was "played" it was simply because of playing my role. Men tend to play games. I agree with the comment about a woman being seen as a trick if she was to act like a man. Men's egos will not allow that to happen to them. They are filled with far more pride and just as jealous as a woman if not more.

    Lying doesn't have to be done. It really doesnt. the truth is actually the best way to start a relationship and maintain it. I believe that things will blossom a lot faster because of honesty.

    while in a relationship, if you have to lie, then you need to reevaluate and possibly leave the commitment.

    does anyone have any examples of why they may need to lie? keep in mind that it does contradict the idea of relationships, monagamy, and commitment to one.

  • http://traumaanddrama.blogspot.com Ms. Sylaneous

    *I didn't read any of the responses yet... I'll do it when I get home after work**

    My take:

    PLEASE DON'T LIE...
    like it was said in the post: 'just be up front, let the truth be told, let us (the women) decide what we want to do about it...and trutfully (maybe sadly true) most of us will STILL stick around...'

    I HATE when people say 'women can't handle the truth'. THAT is one of the biggest cop outs I've ever heard. It's not that we can't handle the truth, it's that often times the man can't handle our reaction to the truth that he's opted to hold on to for far too long...making the time spent together a lie...

    If you cheat on me, don't really wanna be with me...TELL ME. I'm human, I'll probably be mad, I'll be hurt, I'll be sad and all that, but at least I know and not the world! It SUCKS (and yes- I know this from personal experience) to be running around claiming 'oh yeah my man and I blah blah blah'... doing things for 'my man' and what not and find out that 'my man' riding around the chic from campus across town in MY car. And when I ask him, he studders, with this whole, 'I wanted to tell you, but you woulda went crazy'. LOL Are you serious? As oppsed to what I MAY do now? (BUT being the person I am, no tear fell, I got my car key, drove to my apt, boxed his things up- not destroying anything- dropped them by HER place and told her to tell him, 'have a good one'... THAT freaked him out...LOL Oh- I was steaming on the inside though, but wasn't gonna let him know it!... that calm silence drove him crazy- didn't konw what to expect! LOL)

    You don't want me, I'm okay with that, YOU'RE the fool (yeah, sometimes I will get my uppity-ness on if I need to LOL). You only wanna fuck and not progress this thing... aight, cool, just let me know so I don't catch all these feelings and then get hurt by you dating somebody else... just say it...say it... SHEESH! TELL THE TRUTH PEOPLE... saves lots of lives, feelings, cars, and apparently, in some cases... balls! LOL

  • sugar

    Ms. Sylaneous

    "I HATE when people say ‘women can’t handle the truth’. THAT is one of the biggest cop outs I’ve ever heard. It’s not that we can’t handle the truth, it’s that often times the man can’t handle our reaction to the truth that he’s opted to hold on to for far too long…making the time spent together a lie"

    your comment was absolutely great and on point!!! real talk forreal.

  • Momof3

    I haven't read any of the comment yet so forgive me if I'm being a tape recorder.

    EVERYONE says "just keep it real", " I'm as real as it gets", "you don't have to lie to kick it", yet we ALL continue to lie... If every person who claims be be 'real" really were there would be NO liars. I lie to get the truth. I lie to avoid conversations, heck i lie just for fun sometimes... But when it comes to being committed that's where I draw my lying line... I've never lied about being faithful. I cheated once, never would have gotten caught because we lived in a different state but my conscience got to me and i told on myself. I just kept thinking, " if the shoe were on the other foot (and it has been) I'd want to know... Oh and you were referring to SNAPPED that's my ish!

  • Rastaman

    @DC Man With a Plan

    I am not certain if thats is how I would have said it myself but I try not to bludgeon with my opinions. LOL!

    It is understandable to me that some women will claim overwhelmingly to be the victim of men's deceit in their relationships. Afterall the woman who killed Steve McNair was not unaware he was married, he was famous and his wife lived in the same city. She just bet wrong, lost and decided her only option was violence.

    Everyone claims they don't want to be lied to but they want to be charmed, complimented and told they are the greatest.

    But very few of us have the stomach for plain truth. it is reflected in our culture everyday as we increasingly desire more escapism rather than facts. The news is too unpleasant and real life too mundane. We live in a Peter Pan culture where grown men and women perpetuate their own adolesence.

  • da ThRONe

    I dont think the problem is lying. I think its why you lie. Is it to BS or get over on others or is it to avoid hurting people feeling. Sometimes you need to save people from themselves.

    I am a huge advocate of being as honest as you are comfrontable being with a person who has potential of being special to you. Lying is a good measuring stick for me. If I have to lie to you I dont like you very much and perfer not to tell you. While if Im almost brutally honest I like you so much that I want you to know me and get to know you.

    Lying sounds worse than what it is. Lets face it some people are conditioned to be lied to. I try to be as honest as possible. But some females(people) are so insecure

    *cough* "THEY CANT HANDLE THE TRUTH"!

  • Gemini

    @DC Man. WHAT!? Where did you read in my comment that I was lied to and took up with losers and stayed??? My rule going in is..."If you F**k on me I'm gonna to F**k right back on you". If he can't handle that then I know he's a dirty dude just trying to get in.

    Two wrongs don't make it right it makes us even!

    The only thing I miss about a man is getting stuff from the higher shelves because I'm short. The lying, and BS I can live without.

  • Urggh

    I try to keep it 100% honest in every relationship (romantic or platonic) and I hope that a man would do the same for me. I establish pretty early on to my man that honesty is better than hiding stuff, whatever he has done...we can work out (and that might mean going our separate ways) and the same goes for me, whether he accepts it or not.

    Unfortunately, it is true...women don't like to hear the truth. I am not looking for a relationship is normally translated to "Maybe you can change my mind about entering a relationship if you do this that and the other for me". If a man says he does not want a relationship with you, then he doesn't want a relationship with you. All that "we were doing couple stuff" is for the birds. If his words and actions don't match then something is fishy. We are all adults and can use our words. It is hard for me to sympathize with any woman (or man) that knowingly deals with an unavailable man (woman), I don't care what he told you in the beginning. You walked eyes open into that lie.

    Both sexes lie, period.

  • DC Man With a Plan

    lmao...A'ight, Gemini.... I got you. I'ma leave you alone (you're typing in CAPS and you got me worried)...lol......I don't believe in lying ladies. honest. The truth is always best and easiest. NOW, this is for informational purposes ONLY! IF dude tells you he loves you after less than 60 days--be VERY suspicious, especially if you haven't slept with him. AND for real for real: tell him at date 2 or 3 that you're NOT giving up any kisses, feels or azz until at least 6 months have passed, bcuz YOU believe it takes that long to get to know someone, which means testing, meeting in person and speaking almost daily, not "I'll call you in six months so we can resume getting to the being naked part again".....This is my official contribution to a moment in TRUTH.
    Unoffically, if you're too hot in the azz, or if dude "sounds" really convincing, give it a try bcuz eventually, pre-marital sex DOES lead to committed, long term relationships or even marriage.....for someone!

  • mizze

    @DC

    Hahahahahahahahhaha..wow.. I never talked to you once yet you feel the need to talk to me!? Wow! Why are you so ANGRY?? Hahahaa..wow! Did something I said to somone else offend you so much? oh god, if you read any other post I have commented on in regards to relationships I have stated numerous times that me and my FIANCEE have been together for 4 and a half years. So whatever little concept you have about me is just as wrong as you always are..

    I clearly said I agreed with everything Rasta said so how is it that it seems both of you didn't get that? Hummm.. Was offering other instances of why men lies as well through what I said but like I said- there aren't conversations only monologues..nobody wants to hear anything but themselves.. Huuuuuummmmm I guess

    WOW! ...arguin with a fool..so I'm jus gon go on about my day

  • Cool Breeze

    @ MsHollywood

    Just started reading some comments and I just wanted to say that the Tiger Woods example really doesn't work because chances are Tiger didn't really want to settle down at all but he's got a team of people behind him driving his whole image. They tell him "Okay Tiger, you're getting near 30 and our market research shows that people want to see you married with kids" and he goes along with it. Shit, I wonder if he even really wanted to patch things up after she found out or if that decision was only reached after a pow wow with his people.

    As far as the topic goes, I co-sign NWSO 100%. I'm a somewhat blunt person when it comes to relationships and IMO lying = a slow death for a relationship, esp if its a doozy of a lie. If you feel you can't tell that other person the truth, either you know you shouldn't have been messing with them in the first place (crazy/psycho/etc) or you're just too selfish to be in a relationship.

    Also daThrone wrote some pure truth in his last comment.

  • Private Dancer

    The angry black woman post has taken the comments on this blog to a whole new negative level amongst some folks and I am really not liking it. I do not have the time to go back through and find exactly "who" started it but it is out of hand. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the attacking of each on here is really beginning to take away from the flow of mature dialog NWSO has worked so hard to build. What a shame.

  • The Duchess

    Trone- I agree ;)

    I agree Cool Breeze!

  • Anonymous

    I agree with BangShang. People say they want the truth, but the truth hurts.

  • The Duchess

    I rather be hurt by the truth than a lie.. TELL ME THE TRUTH AT ALL TIMES!!!!!!!!!!!

    If you have HIV, Herpes, Chlmydia, still fucking your baby momma, expecting a child in a couple of weeks or in 9 months, broke, like to play w/men on occassions or like to wear womans underwear on the weekends or right before dinner, I want the TRUTH!!

  • da ThRONe

    @The Duchess

    While a hand full of us can handle real shit because we understand we all have issues most people cant. If you spend a life time being judged it's hard to tell something that might change their opinion of you. Especially to someone who you fear losing.

  • http://www.candidbackshots.com guttaman

    How to save your relationship.

    Hey ladies. Do you want to make sure your relationship stays strong and healthy?

    Or aren’t you tired of having relationships that start off good only to end in failure?

    This may be a hard pill to swallow but here is my solution to at least 50% percent of unsuccessful relationships.

    Ladies, let your man sleep around. Not all the time or anything. I’d recommend at least two times a year.

    You’re probably thinking right now…. “wow, this is some terrible advice” but just consider this. Nearly half of people admit to being unfaithful at some point in their lives, according to some surveys and 65 percent of marriages break up because of adultery.

    Let’s face it monogamy is hard to maintain especially in a relationship that is years old. I would argue that fidelity is even that much more difficult for men. Lots of women are not even aware that their boyfriends/ husbands are cheating on them. ***In fact studies show that 70 percent of married women are unaware of their cheating spouse. Allowing your partner to occasionally mess around on the side would allow more honesty and truthfulness within many partnerships. A lot of women are more hurt by the lying and deceitfulness associated with cheating more so than the actual act.

    candidBACKShotS.com

  • http://nwso.net NWSO

    @GuttaMan

    Do you really believe that would work? If so, then what's the point of making the commitment of marriage if one person is going to allow the other to have coochie coupons and dick discount tickets? Also, in this plan do women get to do what they want as well? Seems only fair.

    I mean if folks are swingers then cool, but I doubt this would work for most folks. Although I do see what you're getting at, i'll stick to keeping mine in my wife's skirt and out of any other random broads.

  • Lonias

    @guttaman

    Let's say I take your advice (and let's face it: people are living their lives according to this fictional scenario anyway)...
    This advice applies to one subject a man may lie about.
    What do I do (allow?) to keep things honest surrounding finances? Employment? STDs/other disease?
    Just for example...

    PS...ANYONE can answer...

  • QuoteMan

    Although I have enjoyed today's topic of discussion, I have a question for all the fervent gender bashers, men & women alike who have used this medium to vent against the opposite sex, is it feasible to have a civil dialogue without chastising one another?. Damn some of y'all need therapy while others need to head back. Lol. Thank God! Tomorrow is wet Wednesday

  • http://whetheryoulikeitornot.wordpress.com booboonotthefool

    @ Dc man with a plan:
    I'm just curious, if a man got in the woman's role and none of the gender scripts changed, it really wouldn't be a man walking in a woman's shoes. I personally think that gender role joint is a generalization: why does paying for things give you an excuse to lie?

    Women AND men want to be in relationships, and I don't think anyone has to lie to get what they want. Several of the women comments say that if a man would have keep it 100% he might got what he tried to lie to get. If women should learn to think like men/learn from their mistakes, then it seems a man who gets the windows bussed out his hard ala Jasmin Sullivan should learn from theirs/think like women. Lying give you a short term gain, being truthful probably gets you what you want more often. Even if it takes longer to get, you might be able to have it for longer

  • The Duchess

    :neutral: Guttaman..

    Infidelity=Low Self Esteem

  • da ThRONe

    I will only speak for myself. The only time I have been in love I had no desire to sleep with other females.

  • artsyheartsy

    @GuttaMan

    Is she supposed to let him get semi-annual strange and not get any for herself? Please clarify? Cause Monogamy is not easy for women either. If people are honestly non-monogamous and work out mutually acceptable ground rules I say it's all good. But if each partner's needs are not equally valued and considered it seems to me that folks are setting themselves up for more drama on a different day.

    NEVER set up a situation where one partner is left feeling like a martyr while the other is playing like a satyr...

  • Nicki

    Okay these type of questions are beginning to work my nerves. Everyone wants to debate wether lying and hurting people has any merit. No on both accounts because when we(men and women) it is always for selfish reasons.
    People be grown and straight up. Learn from life. People stop fucking with people we really dont give a damn about. People stop trying to have your cake and eat it too.
    As far as women thinking like men and vice versa. respect eachother and go from there. "do unto others as you would have them do unto you". Isay this to shit always comes back and bites you in the ass. This a guarantee to happen wether its now or later in life.
    This debate is why a sista stays single for so long.
    P.S. Men and women learn to want to better for your lives and these things will be a no brainer.

  • Nicki

    @guttaman
    None of what you said makes sense. We have been allowing men to use the excuse "its in a mans nature to cheat" for so long we still beleive it. Its ridiculous! By the way women always have clues that their men are cheating. They just choose to ignore it. Men always change behavior, habits, leave stuff around, change communication methods or something. It can be the smallest change,but if watched carefully that change will turn into something bigger and snowball.

  • illbdat

    great comments....I've had the opposite senario.... I had this one shorty that I was kicking it for a while and we never went over the parameters of our "situation"......... so one day she randomly asks whats my situation...... so i tell her.... and guess what? she tells me she wish i lied to her or kept it to myself ( go figure) so after that it was pretty much through....

    @ NWSO and all the commentors....

    I pose another question.... would you rather be blissfully ignorant or "in the know" and unhappy (well maybe for some people not unhappy but you get the gist of what i am saying)?

    example: you are in a a relationship for 20 years monogamus.... and @ your 20th year celebration... someone tells you they could tell you if your S.O. has been faithful or not in the past 20 years... would you want to know?

  • karmagini

    Nobody GETS suckered, they CHOOSE to be suckered into something. If one practices the philosophy of lying being necessary or justifiies it because of courtship rules, then they will reap what they sow. If you set the foundation for a relationship with lying, don't be surprised when your mate is lying too. NOT justifiying it. Just saying like attracts like.

    Why don't we just be honest for the moral, compassionate sake of things?

    I have lied & been lied to in my dealings with men. It's not something I practice now, in any aspect of my life. There's much peace to be had from telling the truth. Plus, you never have to keep your story straight.

    I have also been upfront about what my expectations were & had the same in return. I have to say that is a refreshing approach that induces much less conflict. I have more respect for a man who admits from the jump he doesn't want anything serious. Saves me time & him.

    As for those men or women that just all of a sudden go nuts, cheat or do something else highly dishonest... I don't think those traits come out all of a sudden for 90% of people. Many times ignorance is bliss, and there were probably red flags abound that should've been obvious.

  • dee

    Men can not deal with pressure situations.... so rather than face a hard issue they most of the time will lie. That is just how i feel.

    I do agree with the men when they say actions speak louder than words. If i am dating a guy and he started off saying he wants to be in a relationship i pay attention to see if his action coincide with that. If i actually do see those signs ( limited calling, not seeing him regularly, him revealing very little about his self, not including me in his world) im going to take that as you dont want to be in a relationship. Then since i dont just date for dating sake...i will simply say this isnt gonna work and part ways. I have done in the past. You should be able to tell if someone wants to be in a relationship.

    On another note.... some men are good jugglers. they can be selling the dream to more than 1 person and living up to it. Lies usually eventually come out.

    One thing i can stand though is when a man lies till the very end. If i found out your lying and confront you..take the loss. If you try to stick with the lie im going to take it as you insulting my intelligence and that really makes me mad. Men need to learn to bow out gracefully. p.s you dont get points for telling the truth in the end

  • P-la

    Have you ever been lied to by someone you were dating? Yes

    How did you find out?
    Caught him with another women.

    Did they give you a valid reason for their deception or was it a big load of crap?
    No, valid reason. He says he had a mental breakdown.

    How long did you stay with them afterwards?
    Not another day after the incident.

    Would you have more respect for a partner that was straight up with you?
    Yes, I would have the upmost respect for a partner that was straight up with me.

    Or do you believe that ignorance is bliss?
    No, I don't.

    Do you feel that one sex is more likely to lie than the other or is that based more on the individual’s character?
    No, I don't feel that one sex is more likely to lie than the other. I think lying is based on the individual's character.

    Does your mate have the right to destroy your property or physically harm you if they catch you in a devastating lie?
    No, but in reality, emotions take over and I know anything is possible in the heat of the moment.

    Have you ever lied to someone you were dating?
    Yes

    Why? To protect them from getting their feelings hurt.

    Did you ever get caught in the lie? No

    Why do you think so many people lie instead of telling the truth?
    For various reasons, from my experience many of them lie to gain (financial, material, monetary) in all ways possible.

  • QuoteMan

    @guttaman

    Are you serious? If you are, will you ever offer this advice to your daughter someday?

    Now, Lonias and any lady who will consider this advice I question your sanity. With such an inane advice, you have acknowledge that your man deserve a couchie free pass twice a year. I can promise you for certain, the next year he will ask for an increase to maybe one, then two more, by the 6th, 7th.... 10th year why don't you just give him the entire playboy mansion(minus Hugh Hefner LOL)

    Ladies, don't start shit you can finish. GTFOH

  • Lonias

    @QuoteMan
    Two words: Devil's Advocate

  • Sherell

    @Da throne
    Where do you get your numbers? Most can not , a hand full can!!!

    Is it about what folks can handle or about how you handle yourself?

    Being honest shows you have integrity and respect It's a cop out to say people can not handle the truth. What does not handle it mean? That they change up on you.? Not liking something doesn't mean you can not handle it.

    Also timing plays a big role. When you tell lthe truth really makes a difference. The sooner the better.
    A great time would be before you get intimate IMAO.

  • QuoteMan

    @Lonias

    OK, I gotchu, my bad

  • Elle

    I love how this turned into explaining to us women why we are being lied to and how we sort of bring it upon ourselves.

    Awesome. I love it!

    Lying is an indicator of weakness. Why? Because the liar does not want to face whatever the truth may lead to. So even if women ask questions they will not like the answers to, a man of integrity will tell the truth regardless because it is important to HIM to be truthful. And he will be man enough to face whatever the consequences of the truth will be. It's not that hard when you are an adult, you know. The same applies to women. I solely focused on this kind of scenario because I am a woman.

    I have to agree with most Rastaman said. Lies do insult my intelligence. And I do not take those insults lightly because apparently the liar has no idea who he/she is truly dealing with. And in return I can only assume I have no clue who I am dealing with either.

    On another note, I disagree with the common notion of "actions speak louder than words". That may be true in some cases but definitely all or most. I have come across a guy in the past who ACTED like a boyfriend in the true sense of the word but would not say anything in regards to what kind of relationship we were having. There was no way to get any kind of info out of that dude. Sometimes it is best to pay attention to what is NOT being said - all actions aside - because after all a person can always hit you with the "I never said we were in a relationship"-comback.
    Actions and words have to be in sync. Whenever they are not (in either one direction) there is something fishy about the situation IMHO.

  • N2Deep

    It's so easy to think about telling the truth but it's not always as easy to say it. Telling the truth is not a man or woman thing but it seems like "more men lie" is what a lot of women say.

    People tell lies all the time like rastaman said, to get out of trouble or for fear of something. I'm not saying it's right by no means but sometimes it keeps the peace when things might not be going as good as one person may think.

    I mean how many of you have ever been in a relationship where your S.O. pissed you off so bad that you were ready to breakup that day and then two days later they do something that brings the love back out! Oh I guess when I feel like I want to leave I need to be honest and say I want to leave your ass.....What If I feel like this once a month?

    The point I'm making is sometimes it's better to say everythings good (even though it's not) until you can get to a point where you can really think about what you want to do. Most of the time things work themselves out.

    I use to be the type where I was quick to go on to another one and I always told the truth. If I wasn't exclusive with a girl I would let them know. If I had a main one I let them know if she wanted to settle down then thats who I would choose. I used the truth to not get so involved with women and it caused some hurt because they were fine until I had to remind them of what was said up front.

    I was working in another state and I'm a flirt so I hooked up with this girl, she had a man and I told her I had a lady at home. My lady and I were not at the exclusive stage but I always let it be known so there wouldn't be no shit! Anyways before me and this woman started kickin it I told her that I was going to make her feel like she wants to leave her man but she better keep him and also to let me know if she starts catching feelings and I would tell her the same so we could make decisions from there......... She ended up leaving her man but we never got to the point that she or I discussed feelings until oneday her sister made the comment that she was my number 1 lady and I said yeah she can be that except in my home state. This woman started crying and was angry and upset with me but I reminded her of what we said upfront and that still didn't make it easier. She told me she hated me and actually found out where I lived through one of the guys I worked with and drove 9 hours to stalk my ass for a weekend!!

    ...........That was crazy!! but that was mild compared to a few others. I had one threaten to shoot me and one that tried to kill me and her by driving 110 mph on the wrongside of a highway at night where 18 wheelers usually travel. This one was mad because I stepped to her and she told me she had a man so I just talked to her as a friend. When she saw me kickin it with another girl who was ending her relationship and wanted to get with me she didn't like it. She tried to trap me in by letting me hit but before we did anything I told her that I was still going to talk to the other girl. She had the chance first but didn't take it and didn't "Handle the truth" very well either because she thought her sex was going to change my mind.......

    I'm not saying I lie now, I'm just saying that there is lot more to it than on the surface. People need to think about the things that they lie about that is overlooked and then weigh the importance of potentially hurting or losing someone you really love. Anger can make us fuck up sometimes where we really don't mean to do things but we allow shit to go a little too far.

  • rwifey

    ignorance is an amazingly blissful state, go 'head, lie to me

  • DC Man With a Plan

    On behalf of my fellow men, I declare that we all know and appreciate that lying is wrong for any reason. We also want ladies to know, you should not feel entitled to, or expect honesty from every man you meet. No one owes you honesty no matter how nice that would be. AND if you remember nothing else, THAT statement will serve you well as you navigate relationships and determine when and how you learn to trust the SPECIFIC man you are dealing with.
    Ultimately, it is up to EACH of us to OWN the process by which we expose our heart and minds to the persons we want to ALLOW into our lives.

  • mizze

    @Elle

    Thank you! That was the entire point I was tryin to make but people without the ability to comprehend that didn't quite get it! I am with you 100%! Like I said in my first comment, if a man tell you one thing but act another way..its confusing! I do believe that they have to go hand in hand..they can "ACT" like you guys in a relationship but tell you he don't want to commit. So if "actions speak louder than words"- yall must be in a relationship right? Well at least according to what some people on here say.

  • The Duchess

    I think it's HILARIOUS when people put themselves in some shit but don't see they were the cause of it.

    N2- You could have alleviated all that shit if you weren't so promiscuous.. Can't fuck with a female then tell her not to catch feelings. Obviously her relationship wasn't going well so she saw you as her rebound no matter WHAT you said to her or what the two of you "supposedly" agreed to.

    Much love goes out to you & I enjoy reading you ;)

  • Rastaman

    Trust but verify!!

  • Caribeza

    You know it's funny but women lie all the time. We may not cheat but in relationships or "non-relationships" - we omit, manipulate, bend or shade the truth, nag, accept some things while deviously maneuvering for change later, ignore the obvious facts because if he loves me enough he'll change ... all in order to get the golden grail from our little girl/princess fairy-tales - to catch a man.

    We get lied to and then get really angry or snap because we can't face the truth - we played ourselves - we saw the signs and ignored our gut feeling that something was wrong. So we'd rather blame another person than ourselves because we feel embarrassed, foolish, or ashamed.

    I'm not saying there aren't great liars out there but sooner or later something doesn't quite add up. If you want a certain type of relationship, don't lie and accept less until you can use sex/time/ social pressure or nagging to eventually change the other person's mind. Then you go crazy and blame the other person for your stupid choices. Be honest, admit it was a stupid choice and move the hell on and don't make the mistake again.

    Don't give your all to a person that you've only known for a few months and you don't know their intimate family, their intimate friends. Don't continue giving your all to a person who seemed nice and you've kind of known for years but then something is not quite right - he's distant, you don't hang out with his friends, you get the sense that he's avoiding certain questions. Especially if you're not getting exactly what you want - a committed 50-50 relationship - if that's what you want.

    A lot of the issues with lying come about because of what mizze about there being no conversations only intersecting monologues.
    Men and women in general do communicate differently and everyone sees things from this biased spot in their heads - especially when it comes to emotions. And for some people the lie you think they told you could be due to social conditioning the truth they believe in thier own heads.

    A lot of women and men on this blog don't get played or at least not for long because they see the signs, accept responsibility and get the hell out of Dodge.

    I've been seriously played for a couple of years by someone I considered a friend. I went kamikaze, f..cked with his privacy and all sorts of shit but at the end I had to accept a lot of the blame for allowing so many things to slide for so many years. I accepted that I was an idjit, took some of the blame on my shoulders, accepted the shame and moved the hell on.

  • DC Man With a Plan

    @ Elle...Part of "acting" like a boyfriend is SAYING you're a woman's man. If you "thought" dude was acting like a boyfriend but he neva said he was one, your concept of what a boyfriend is and what it looks like was off. Thus "behavior" as well as non-verbal behavior are definitely indicators of how a man carries a relationship. It can't just be a woman's concept since it involves men. U gotta add the man's view into the equation to come up with a TRUE result. There's an exception to every rule, but the RULE still stands.

  • Private Dancer

    @Rastaman: I like that. "Trust but verify."

  • lola289

    People LIE to get what they want. PERIOD!

    ppl need to 'man up' and tell the truth...
    and accept the truth as well.... smh

  • insecret

    Hmmm, interesting how this turned into a post about MEN who lie to WOMEN. I'd say that both sexes lie and are capable of doing so. I believe that any relationship bulit on a foundation of mistruths and half-truths is eventually going to reap negative consequences.

    So let me flip it for you all here. I have an STD. It is not fatal, but it's chronic. My most recent partner did not know. We hooked up again after several years apart. We had other issues, based on our relationship in the past, due to his dishonesty.

    I believe because we were together several years ago, I was never asked about any STD's or asked to get tested. In my experience women are much more careful about that than me. If they think you look OK, they don't ask questions. In our go-round this time, I insisted, even when he wanted to go raw, that we always use condoms.

    The irony is that he did something similar to me by not telling me the entire truth about his relationship when we first hooked up (the time before this time.) So in a sense, I'd say it's karma, although I had no revenge in mind when we hooked up again.

    I simply did not feel the relationship was going to be serious and that he didn't need to know. Is that lying? I guess so. I felt guilty about it at first, but after subsequent disrespectful behavior on his part, I no longer felt that bad. I know that there are others on here, who may not have the courage despite the anonymity online implies to share their status, but many, many people are struggling with this issue in silence. A lot of people do not tell and many others don't even know they have it, which is why this STD has become so common.

    Don't ask or don't tell? When it's not you, it's easier to see it as a moral imperative. But when it's you, things are a little dicier.

    I think it's best to tell the truth and one thing I've learned from this is that whether you can be honest or not truly does determine how much you care about the person or the relationship.

    If someone is lying to you, on some level they don't respect or care or trust you enough to tell the truth. It could be 20 years in, they could say they love you, but there is a disconnect there somewhere. It may not be you, though, just that person's survival tactic. For me I believe it often supports an inability to be truly intimate, often because of family or origin issues, etc. Often lying is a survival tactic in famiilies that becomes a lifetime habit. Women do usually have more support systems in their lives through other women than men do, so that may be why they can be more honest.

    That's my take. You'll probably judge me regardless, but as they say, untiil you've walked a mile in my shoes...I would have honestly felt the exact same way before I found out what I found out....

  • Anonymous

    The show is called "Snapped"!

  • The Duchess

    Insecret- WOW! You in the end have to live with yourself! It is partly because of people who think like you that HIV/Aids is running rampant.. I will pray for you but spreading herpes to anyone knowingly, is a MAJOR mental issue!
    Hope you get the assistance you require soon!

  • N2Deep

    @Duchess
    Thank You for Spreading the Love ; -)

    I second that about Insecret. Thats another point where honesty is needed. That's a must because your playing with other peoples life!!

    You have to take responsibility for right now because your past is just that. You entered into it this go around knowing full well of what happened before so if you were not sure then why did you hook back up and if you wanted revenge why didn't you just cheat or something a lot less destructive and deliberate. You said it's not fatal but the truth of the matter is what is not fatal for you could be for someone else. And I got to tell the truth if I was on the receiving end and I found out you already knew I might be one of the few men that "Did the Snapping" on the show SNAPPED!

  • Siante J

    It all depends on why you're lying. Not all folks can handle the truth as it is, and some folks can't deal with the repeated rejection as a result of telling the truth.

    In a perfect world, honesty would be the best policy and drama would be the last thing to show up. But we don't and it shows up quickly

  • insecret

    @Duchess:
    @N2Deep
    I'm not trying to justify anything but since this is a forum where folks can speak their minds honestly, I thought I'd share my situation. See it as a cautionary tale. Do you know whether or not you have herpes? A lot of folks are spreading it unknowingly. Because I know what's up at the very least I am responsible with my partner. He has never asked and was willing to go raw, but I won't let that happen. My point is not about morality, it's about reality. The person who gave it to me wasn't truthful, nor was he at least responsible about it. If I was in a monogamous relationship with someone I truly loved, I'd let them know the truth. That's my point. When you are not totally truthful with someone, you are not truly loving them.

    I would also say that herpes is rampant and most people don't realize that you have to specifically ask to be tested for it via a blood test. If you are getting an STI screen, it does not automatically include it. So word to the wise. Trust and believe I'm not the only person on this forum who knows they have it and is not being completely forthcoming with a partner. If I could impart anything to anyone reading this, especially women, but also to men, protect yourself. You just can't always count on the truth from people. Whether you judge it or not, people are human and they act accordingly.

  • http://nwso.net NWSO

    @Insecret
    @duchess
    @N2deep

    Y'all should peep this post I did last year on that very topic of sleeping with someone with herpes

    http://www.nakedwithsockson.com/2009/06/18/i-have-herpes-can-we-still-have-sex/

  • insecret

    @NWSO

    Thanks for posting the link to this...it's very helpful to those of us who suffer in silence. Your blog is truly a public service.

  • Luxe

    I definitely have lied to past boyfriends to get what I wanted. Mainly my dishonesty was due to immaturity and greed. Whether you're male or female, I think that a time comes when you're aware of what you want, you realize that anyone who doesn't want you as you are and will put up with your shit diesnt really love you, and you learn really embrace the golden rule. I think its just part of growing up. Some folks don't do that until... well damn...never.

    I think its just extra exhausting to have to keep up a lie. Its way more fun to live your life, and go for the things you want while being completely honest.

  • The Duchess

    Insecret- Ummmm YES I know for a FACT I don't have herpes.. I frequent every STD test known to man.. Whomever is not aware that herpes is only tested for when requested should not be having sex!
    As far as you STILL having sex with ppl that don't know you have herpes, shame on YOU! I know PLENTY of ppl with herpes & they find their partners on websites that cater to ppl who have herpes. You are still in denial cause if you were not, you wouldn't have sex with folks without forewarning them of your condition. Just because it was done too you DOES NOT mean you should continue their reckless pattern!
    Being truthful=Love? I don't think so. It is about being true to yourself.
    Wish you well & I will pray for the men you are putting at risk!

  • Anonymous

    @Duchess it must be nice to view the world from your lofty position of never doing anything wrong or making a mistake. I shared since the subject was lying to a partner and I thought it might also help some people. You apparently just responded to judge. That's fine, I don't owe you an explanation or a justification. I certainly hope you'll never find yourself in a situation where choices aren't always clear. To ease your mind, though, there is only ONE partner in question and he doesn't need your sympathy. Please save your prayer for your own judgmental self.
    I believe that truth does indeed equal love. And because you can count on people to act as human beings that's what you should consider before giving them your trust.

  • The Duchess

    Insecret/Anonymous- I don't judge EXCEPT when it comes to ppl putting innocent peoples lives at risk! Once you get a tad older & wiser, you will understand!
    FYI: I responded cause your comment seemed like you were getting revenge on a person you had previous dealings with that used to screw u or others over.

  • http://liferequiresmorechocolate.blogspot.com Tiffany

    "Silly rabbit, tricks are for kids" should be the scorned womans motto. When you try to play someone prepared to get burned. I do feel for people who have had extreme things happen to them and there is no excuse for the act, but when you see that a woman could flip out on you why would you tempt it and lie or continue lying. I know I have lied, but I never lied continuously to keep a man and I never will. My mindset won't let me keep a lie too long.

    Tiffany
    http://liferequiresmorechocolate.blogspot.com/

  • N2Deep

    @Inseccret

    You are using the excuse that every human is not perfect but in this case your truth is aimed on this blog when it should have been at the individual you are/were involved with. You say no to going raw but nobody has any control on if the rubber breaks!! Regardless of your carefulness you are not allowing him to either further protect his self or decide not to be sexually involved with you.

    I have to tell you also that YOU provided all the information so nobody is judging they are sharing their opinions! That's What blogs are for!!

  • N2Deep

    @NWSO

    I read that previous piece and all the comments and I can understand ppl not wanting to be an outcast.

    Probably the hardest thing for ppl that have gotten a disease to accept is that they have to change their lifestyle. I know that some folks only let you know a portion of their life and to have to share something that is considered personal and not so good has to be hard. Even though it may be hard, it is necessary.

    We all want to be special but at the least we want to be normal.

    One thing I think folks who know they have a disease should think about is this:

    What if the person that your not telling is slept with someone who is slept with someone who is sleeping with someone you do care about?

  • The Duchess

    N2- EXACTLY!

  • Ms. Parker

    I believe if you tell the truth up front and let the person know EXACTLY what you're looking for and get CLARIFICATION then that shows maturity and it should not be any drama. Atleast this gives a person an opportunity to see if they want to continue in the relationship.

    But when you lie and give false expectations then of course feelings get hurt, emotions are running high and some folks just snap!

  • jazzy

    A lot of comments but this crystallizes the reality for both sides!

    Use Me - Bill Withers

  • Pingback: Why Do People Lie in Relationships? | Naked With Socks On - Dating Tips and Tricks

  • Tejan

    I think some people lie in a relationship simply because they are afraid of what their partner might think or do. I have some friends who tell their partner what they want to hear simply because they want to avoid arguments. This is especially true with jealous spouses who freak out at simple things like the gender of a co-worker you have no interest in whatsoever, but your spouse thinks you are sleeping with. Many people lie just to avoid the accusations.

    Reminds me of the time I was accused of sleeping with a friend of mine by her husband. No, never happened. But now that you mention it, and since you already think I did it, perhaps I should go ahead and fulfill your wish and just sleep with her after all. (Note: I am being sarcastic.) Well, she started lying to her husband about seeing me, even though nothing was happening and never did.

    Ideally, I think that it is important to find someone who you can be totally honest with and be yourself with. I was lucky enough to find one such woman. All the others before her, I had to pretend to be someone I was not just to live up to their expectations. I never really lied, per say, but I was not true to myself, which is worse.

    1.) If you cannot be yourself in a relationship, you picked the wrong partner or are not being self-expressed.

    2.) Many people cause their spouses to lie, because they cannot handle the truth and freak out over tiny things, rather than having real discussions and dealing with whatever comes up like adults.